Hot and heavy in the shrinking tent... Operatic Ohio.


17 comments posted
Very interesting comment

w/r/t Ohio, DeWine, Hackett and Dean from poster "rumi" at BMT. Obviously conjecture, but it might explain the Deans speaking out quite so forcefully.

Marisacat's picture
Posted by Marisacat on 15 February 2006 - 1:38pm
Howard the Fake

Joshua Frank had his number: The man was never anything but Clinton with a down-East accent. To study his actions in his own state with a practiced eye made this clear. Like Clinton, he knew all along that he could ride well-meaning activists to success, lock them securely in the veal pen, and then move on to another well-paid gig, helping his pals fatten the hapless progs for yet another choreographed slaughter.

Can we please just let go of the notion that these are good people interested in democracy ?

"...Eight Democratic congressmen have filed a bill that combines a laudable goal – public funding of congressional campaigns – with a vicious attack on freedom of speech. The bill would effectively eliminate virtually all congressional campaigns by independent and third-party candidates.

The bill, HR 4694, would provide public financing for both Democrats and Republicans in most districts. But Ballot Access News reports that candidates not qualifying for funding would not only receive no government funds, but would also be barred from spending any privately raised money. No government money and no private money means that a non-qualifying candidate would be prohibited from spending any money at all, not one red cent. Not even a business card with the candidate’s name and office sought would be legal under the bill!.."

alsis39.5's picture
Posted by alsis39.5 (not verified) on 15 February 2006 - 2:12pm
I am very familiar with

Joshua Frank. I will leave it at that...

Thanks for commenting...

Marisacat's picture
Posted by Marisacat on 15 February 2006 - 4:23pm
loud, but not necessarily representative

that is so true. insightful post, marisa. and compliments on your choice, and use, of the photos. they're striking.

Hackett's withdrawal is a canary in the coal mine moment for progressives.

Bring onto the stage the Republican-Democrats! Waiting offstage is the new improvedDemocratic Party©!!! Casey in Pennsylvania. Kaine in Virginia. If "we" can't beat the Republicans? BECOME THE REPUBLICANS!

Real Live Republicans like James Webb!!!!!

James Webb? The new Democratic Senatorial Candidate for the Commonwealth of Virginia? So who's he? And why is he being promoted on the little-d party blogs?

James Webb -- former Secretary of the Navy and all-around gung ho ubermilitarist

But Webb definitely has his dark side. He was one of the ring leaders of the thinly veiled racist campaign against Maya Ying Lin, the designer of the Vietnam War Memorial, which Webb famously called a "wall of shame." The wall, of course, is one of the most brilliant and moving public monuments ever built anywhere -- and also quickly proved to be one of the most popular, which must have driven Webb nuts. Unfortunately, he and his fellow Neanderthals were able to mau mau the National Park Service into planting a couple of faux heroic soldier statues near the wall, adding an ugly splash of neo-Stalinist realism to what is otherwise a postmodernist masterpiece.

All this is just a long-winded way of saying that when it come to the Vietnam War, Webb's views have about as much wisdom and sanity as a Rambo movie. And he has a particular chip on his shoulder about the Vietnam Veterans Against the War -- and John Kerry. Like so many of his fellow bitter enders, he zeroes in on Kerry's 1971 anti-war testimony before the Senate Foreign Relations Committee:

He testified that fellow veterans had routinely "raped, cut off ears, cut off heads, taped wires from portable telephones to human genitals and turned up the power, cut off limbs, blown up bodies, randomly shot at civilians, razed villages in fashion reminiscent of Genghis Khan." With those words, he defamed a generation of honorable men.

I guess Webb still hasn't heard about Tiger Force. And he probably doesn't remember that just three weeks before Kerry testified, a military court martial convicted Lt. William Calley of doing -- and ordering other men to do -- things like this:

Meadlo told about it later: “So we pushed our seven to eight people in with the big bunch of them. And so I began shooting them all. So did Mitchell, Calley … I guess I shot maybe twenty five or twenty people in the ditch … men, women and children. And babies.�

Some of the GI s switched from automatic fire to single-shot to conserve ammunition. Herbert Carter watched the mothers "grabbing their kids and the kids grabbing their mothers. I didn’t know what to do.�

Seymour Hersh

My Lai 4


But, as much as Webb despises Kerry -- and everything he represented back in the day -- he apparently just can't swallow Bush's blunder in Iraq. Ironically, the man who hated the war protesters is now a . . . war protester:

So, this man is a lifelong republican but sees the truth about Bush.

And that somehow makes him a Democrat.

Pretty low bar these days isn't it?

Here's what the Kos, has to say in his fluff piece about Webb.

Wingers are starting to worry about Webb

...Fact is, Webb is exactly what Daily Kos ordered for the Virginia Senate race this year. He's my kind of candidate, and I know many people who would agree....

Wingers worried about Webb? Yeah.


Now is he speaking for himself?

Or is this just the latest inside-the-beltway party line?

And please ignore that sound you hear, that's just the song of the coal mine canary. She's just singing a lullabye to her chicks. Nothing at all to worry about.

bayprairie's picture
Posted by bayprairie on 15 February 2006 - 3:04pm
yeah I'd have to say that Webb

is the most shameful (thanks for getting all of that up, fantastic!)... but there are several. If they are recent Republicans or they voted for Nixon, Reagan, either Bush etc., they need to get that out, be open about it ... Instead what I hear, and heard iwth Marcinkowski in the thread Monday at BMT (oh that was fun to follow, what a hoot!) is they are irritated to be asked. Buck up little heifer!! I say... you are asking for votes and for cash.

We wanna kick the tires. A lot.

Oh I hope 06 is a big surprise to the Est Dems.

Marisacat's picture
Posted by Marisacat on 15 February 2006 - 4:28pm
Have You Considered A Run, Marisa ?

Just wondering. You seem to have all your ducks in a row online. How's your public speaking ?

alsis39.5's picture
Posted by alsis39.5 (not verified) on 15 February 2006 - 6:14pm
If they try to hide it

someone in the blogosphere will reveal it. Might as well be up front about it.

Oh I hope 06 is a big surprise to the Est Dems.

In what way? If they all lose, you will do a happy dance? We won by losing, huzzah! Uhh, wait...

Don't like the candidates that are on offer? Get some new ones! Don't sit around and gripe about how the Democratic Party has abandoned you and/or is all in the control of the moneyMEN who've rigged the game against you. We know that already! Boy do we. And here's a news flash- they aren't going away, win or lose in 06. So let's hear how you plan to get rid of them! Let's see some posts on here about all the letters you've sent to the DNC, or which alternative candidates you endorse and what they're up to. Where's the links for sending them money, where's the links to their blogs and web sites, where are the position statements. Don't like the Democratic Party? Let's see the alternative party you support! No other party to support? Let's see your plans for revolution! (Peaceful of course, hi NSA guys!)

I want to see you succeed, I really do! This country needs a political enema. But just sitting around and rooting against the party that is your best ally because you think they're corrupt isn't going to get you anywhere.

liberalrob's picture
Posted by liberalrob on 15 February 2006 - 6:27pm
I Do What I Can

I know of no local 3rd-Party candidates for House and Senate. (Though I mentioned in the last thread we were both on that I would be proud to vote for such folks if I lived in the right state.) I am holding a house party to try and get a Green on the County Commission, though the race itself is non-partisan.

I remain appalled that Democrats engage in the sort of shennanigans that I linked to above, and that most of their rank-and-file don't seem to care. I wouldn't waste time writing the DNC. I don't want them "reformed" a la' Dean. I want them to go the way of the Whigs, as soon as possible. If they can't afford to deliver the goods to the people, what use are they ? Stop patronizing them and drive them out of business. If I'm going to hell, it might as well be hell with the lid off.

alsis39.5's picture
Posted by alsis39.5 (not verified) on 15 February 2006 - 6:59pm
I will do a happy dance

on their gilded crypts. Yes, I want these fuckers to lose. If I have to choose between real Republicans and Lite Republicans, give me the real thing.

This is like cancer surgery. Better to get the painful part out of the way. Better off in the long run.

"Get us new ones" ... sure, right. Did you read the piece? Did you see almost the entire field of candidates help fund the Osama ad attacking Dean? Have you been paying attention to what Schumer and Emmanuel have been up to?

Madman in the Marketplace's picture
Posted by Madman in the M... on 15 February 2006 - 7:32pm
To pass the time:

liberalrob, how many GE have you voted in? How many Democratic National Conventions can you remember, back into childhood?

Voted in every single national and local election in your district? Ever caste a vote out side the party?

What is your party? Monikers are like something the dog spit up. They just lie there, meaningless... "liberalrob" means jack shit.

Who did you vote for in '72, '76, '80, '84, '88, '92,'96,'00,'04 and the mid terms in between?

do you carefully vote for the central committee on the ballot? Vote in every election for all the judges? Leave anything empty, with hold a vote ever from a pol? Which ones?

Who have you worked for? Donated to? Who pulls your strings?

Marisacat's picture
Posted by Marisacat on 15 February 2006 - 9:22pm
Want my political C.V.?

This ought to be interesting. What will they think, he wondered in the third person...

Let's start with the nick, I chose liberalrob because my name is Rob and my politically-minded friends at work are mostly conservative Republicans (and a couple of guys I've competed against at Strat-o-matic Baseball tournaments are rabid Bush-backers) so I'm always dismissed as a wild-eyed Liberal. Funny, huh? I first used liberalrob on my Blogger login; then as I found that no one was using it on any of the blogs I ran across, I started using it as my nom-de-blog. Maybe I should have used centerleftliberalrob instead, but it's much harder to type.

I have been registered as a Democrat since I first registered to vote; my mother and father are also lifelong Democrats. I was born in 1967, so 1986 was my first midterm election and 1988 was my first Presidential vote. At that time I was living in Kansas and going to the University of Kansas; I voted for Dukakis as the state went 56-43 for Bush. In 1992, I was still in Kansas (after graduation from KU in 1990) and voted for Clinton as Bush won 39-34. In 1996 I had just moved to Texas in June, and again voted for Clinton as Dole won 49-44. In 2000 I voted for Gore, and in 2004 I voted for Kerry. You could say so far I've had the Bob Schrum experience of voting for President. I'm pretty sure I've voted in all the midterms in those years, but I didn't keep records so I may have missed one. I know I've missed a lot of local elections, mainly because I didn't know about them in time; I don't read newspapers and I don't check the League of Women Voters' site as often as I should. Those that I do hear about, I've voted in. I have always voted straight Democratic ticket. I've never been to a Democratic National Convention; I'd love to go though, after being a delegate in 2004 to the Texas Democratic Convention in Houston. That was a lot of fun. My first political memory is watching John Dean testify to the Ervin Committee. At that time I didn't really care about what was going on, obviously; but I've since read All the President's Men and The Final Days several times, seen both movies and Oliver Stone's Nixon, and read the Nixon Transcripts and the Haldeman Diaries. I vaguely remember watching the 1976 convention coverage and seeing Carter's acceptance speech. I don't remember 1980. I do remember Mondale in 1984, and I knew he was going to lose because he was a lousy speaker compared to Reagan. I watched the 1988 convention and knew Dukakis was going to lose because he was a worse speaker than George Bush, which was saying something. In 1991 or 1992 (not sure of the date) I got to go to a Clinton campaign rally in Lake Charles, Louisiana. I'll never forget it, because after he was done speaking the crowd just surged around him and hemmed him in. In a friendly way, we just wanted to shake his hand; but it was eerie how quiet it was! No yelling and screaming, just the rustle of shoes on the concrete floor of the aircraft hangar. He stayed and shook everyone's hand, including mine, and it really almost became one of those I'm-not-going-to-wash-that-hand-for-a-month things. That was the start of my true political awakening I think, when I really started to take political things seriously. That was reinforced in 2003 and 2004 with Howard Dean's candidacy. I started going to meetups and joined DFA (which was then Dean For America). I made signs for his visit to Dallas in 2003 and kept going to the monthly meetup meetings until he was run out of the campaign. That depressed me and I've not been as active since then, but I'm still a Democrat. Somebody in another thread mentioned the Dallas County Sheriff; I actually met Lupe Valdez at the Dallas County Democratic Party office, when I went to deliver the results of my precinct convention after the primary in March. I had no idea who she was, she was there all alone on some errand. We chatted for a minute and she mentioned she was running for Sheriff, which surprised me because she's all of 5' 1" or so. Yeah I know, stereotypes. Anyway she seemed really nice and I voted for her, and she won; and she's been a fine Sheriff.

Back to the questions...I don't know what a central committee is, but I've never left a ballot blank when there was a Democrat to vote for. I have left blanks when Republicans are running unopposed, which seems to happen a lot here. I've worked a little bit for Dean in 2003-4 as I mentioned; I donated $5 to Ciro Rodriguez this year, but he's not running in my district where I'm stuck with Bush rubber-stamp Pete Sessions. That's about it.

So no, I'm not a tremendous activist. I'm an online cheerleader at best. I comment on blogs because I love political discussions. I'm very opinionated, I like defending my positions, and I learn a lot in the process. I believe in women's rights, minority rights, gay rights, and privacy rights. I believe in environmental protection, alternative fuels, the Geneva convention, the United Nations, open government, religious tolerance, separation of church and state, and diplomacy before military action. I believe in the Church of Baseball. I believe Oswald acted alone, though I'm open to the possibility of a second shooter (and I've met Detective Jim Lavelle, who was handcuffed to Oswald when Ruby shot him; he was wearing the white suit in the famous photograph). I believe Kevin Costner is the Al Gore of acting; sometimes the delivery is boring as hell but the message is usually pretty good. I believe the Bible was written by men with an agenda, and is not the inspired Word of God. I don't believe in an all-knowing and omni-present God. I believe Jesus was a real person, but I don't believe in his resurrection. I believe in Free Will.

And nobody pulls my strings but me.

liberalrob's picture
Posted by liberalrob on 16 February 2006 - 4:54pm
LOL well I am laughing.

and it is not "laughing with" you type laughter, fella.

You don't read newspapers, you kinda alternate between a couple political books you have read and some "political" movies, you mimic a dull, tailored speech in Bull Durham and ya met a guy who is in the famous shot of the shot... you vote in the big elections which are advertised for a year, miss the bulk of the smaller local elections as you don't hear of them in time and you







Marisacat's picture
Posted by Marisacat on 16 February 2006 - 8:55pm

Well, you asked who I was and what I was about, and I answered. Politely, just as I have always been polite on this blog. Your post was completely a personal attack on me, the kind of "shoot the messenger" style of "debate" that is typical of BushCo flacks. Take things out of context, sneer, bloviate. So much for rational discourse and winning on the merits! This is more what I would expect to see on freerepublic.

I'm not lecturing, I'm defending my position and offering what I think is reasonable analysis. If you can't tell the difference, too bad. If you can't engage me rationally, I feel sorry for you as I feel sorry for this country where people seem more interested in us vs. them rather than tolerance and understanding.

Glad I can bring a smile to your face, at least. That's something.

finis, indeed.

liberalrob's picture
Posted by liberalrob on 16 February 2006 - 11:32pm
It's not tires

that I want to kick.

Madman in the Marketplace's picture
Posted by Madman in the M... on 15 February 2006 - 7:27pm
Whoops !

I forgot that the Greens are also fielding Gubernatorial candidates in OR. I don't always trust the GP leaders, but I will definitely vote Green for Governor, if only to help the GP preserve its ballot access, which is now even more precarious thanks to the new "bipartisan" measure mentioned earlier.

alsis39.5's picture
Posted by alsis39.5 (not verified) on 16 February 2006 - 9:28am
Fighting Dems

I've never shot anyone, or learned how to crack someone's windpipe with my bare hands, so obviously my opinion doesn't have the same unique perspective as the other brave souls, but great post Marisa!

Stevo's picture
Posted by Stevo on 16 February 2006 - 9:30pm
Thanks for stopping by Stevo

LOL yeah one thing about the Hackett trajectory, from minute one it was going to expository. Of the Dems, of the system, of him, of all sorts of things. To be honest I don't feel anyone came off looking good in this one. We'll see h ow it shakes down.

I am pleased to see some harsh rhetoric out of the Deans at the same time that MoveOn is gearing up their decision to challenge the more conservative Dems who vote with Repubs. works for me.

Marisacat's picture
Posted by Marisacat on 16 February 2006 - 11:22pm