Not liberal enough, not centrist enough, not experienced enough, too much the politician, Obama just can't win ... except, maybe

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4 comments posted
Too Progressive?

Does that idea offend anyone else, or is it just me? I fail to see how one can be too progressive, especially when one is living in a state of corporate fascism.

Barack is a little conservative for my taste, but I could support him if I had to. Don't get too excited yet, though. His numbers were artificially high in Iowa because nearly everyone who turned out to support Richardson, Kucinich, Gravel, Biden or Dodd went to Obama when their candidate failed to reach the 15% requirement. New Hampshire won't be quite so limited, so we'll get a more realistic view of what's going on. I think as it shakes out, Obama and Edwards will end up neck and neck and Kucinich is going to surprise people. Personally, I want all that anti-corporate rhetoric - and the action to back it up, too. This county is out of hand and we need someone to foment a political revolution. I'd rather see Kucinich do it, but I'll settle for Edwards or Obama if I must. I'm not convinced that's the case yet.

What I don't want is more of the DLC's Republican-lite b.s. There's a reason Michael Moore called Bill Clinton this country's most successful Republican president, and I don't want 8 more years of the same. We need an actual Progressive in office yesterday.

Of course, this is all moot if we let the Republicans steal another one.

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Morgaine Swann's picture
Posted by Morgaine Swann on 5 January 2008 - 8:39pm
Kucinich is interesting, and

Kucinich is interesting, and he's much more specific than Edwards, but my own feeling is that he's not really presidential. Edwards, I just don't know what he's about. What bothers me about vague anti-corporate rhetoric is that it means nothing. Communism is anti-corporate, too, but I don't want any part of that. And when nearly all of us work for corporations large and small -- your local newspaper stand, restaurant and independent clothing store are probably corporations -- and our entire economy is founded on the flexibility that corporations provide for doing business, just sounding off about the corporate boogie man isn't going to get us anywhere. What is it about corporations, exactly, that we need to address? Which corporations? How big, how small? How foreign? There definitely are problems, especially in how our political system is corrupted, but blaming "corporations" is like blaming telephones for obscene phone calls.

That's why a more intellectual, more sober approach is what appeals to me. Perhaps appeals to many. We've done the rabid ideologue bit with Bush, and look where it got us? His blinders and stupidity have done more harm than any other president in history, imho. But just pushing back with more ideological stridency of rhetoric that does nothing to draw in all the people out there that might be allies in this is not going to achieve anything, or at least not much of anything.

I'm not talking about appealing to the non-"Democrat" politicians, but the people -- the same people who are talking about "Sicko" -- the same people who are disgusted by what's been happening but just never happened to be raised to vote Democratic -- that is the revolution needed, imho. We the People can do a lot, but not if we continue to let ourselves be divided by a political system that thrives on paralyzing us over petty conflict. The real issues are divisive enough already.

media girl's picture
Posted by media girl on 6 January 2008 - 12:31am
Not presidential?

What about Dennis Kucinich is not presidential? I hear people saying that, but it makes no sense to me. He's the only one that wants to get the profit completely out of our health care system, the way every other industrialized country has. He's been in politics for over 35 years and has a proven record of standing up to privatization and opposing the war in Iraq. I think it's great that the candidates now realize it was a bad idea to invade another country on nothing but smoke and mirrors, but I'll stick with the guy who got it right the first time, and stood up against continuing the occupation in every vote.

Anyone who objects to him based on his looks is too shallow for me to consider. If I cared about looks, I'd be campaigning for Edwards. I want a president who knows what it means to be poor, who supports workers' right to organize , who knows that bombs never solved a problem and never will, and who thinks rich people should pay more taxes than the middle class. Kucinich is for free college education - I haven't heard any other candidate even broach the subject, except Hillary saying the loans will be more affordable. I'd rather they be non-existent. We're behind every other Western country in terms of education - I want every American kid that can qualify to get into college to be able to go. Yes, it would take the cooperation of Congress, but first it takes someone to put forth the idea and have a plan to do it. Dennis has.

Dennis is also the only candidate talking about impeachment. I don't care if Bush only has a few months left. I don't care how much time it would take, or whether it's politically savvy. The Bush Administration has committed crime after crime with complete impunity and I want it stopped. I want action taken because it's the right thing to do. When did we stop doing things because they were politically inconvenient? They said the same thing about civil rights and women's suffrage, too. We fought for those because it was the right thing to do. The right thing to do when a (n unelected) criminal violates the Constitution, our laws, international law and our treaties is to impeach him. The Constitution doesn't say he may be removed - it says he "shall be" removed if he commits crimes. That's pretty clear language.

Which corporations? Any corporation that tries to influence an election. The fact that we allow corporations to fund candidates is obscene. What are we going to do next, let them vote? We just let a couple of networks exclude viable candidates from presidential debates. That's scary stuff. A corporation just let a little girl die from a treatable illness, and she's only one of 18,000 that will die this year for no other reason than that they don't have health coverage. I don't have to tell you that that's six 9/11's every year that wouldn't take place in any other industrialized nation.

We're living in a state of corporate fascism. That's not rhetoric, it's a fact. We've got a private corporation in charge of our monetary system. We're in so much debt to China that they could literally destroy our economy if they wanted to. More people lost their homes last year than any other time in our history. Our jobs are flying off to other countries. Dennis will end NAFTA and get us out of the WTO and I think that's exactly where we need to start to get our economy back on track.

Dennis also has empathy for undocumented workers, and he won't treat them like they have no right to be here. Mexicans are native to the Americas - they have more right here than anyone whose family came in through Ellis Island. If they need to come here and work, we should make it easier for them - instead we're locking entire families up in detention camps. Halliburton just got a contract to build more detention centers on American soil. Who do you think is going to inhabit those centers? It won't just be immigrants, it will be activists they decide to tag as terrorists. Congress is in the process of making it possible.

People have to wake up. Fascism isn't coming, it's here. They've started rounding up undocumented workers and their families - the only question is who the next targeted group will be.

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Morgaine Swann's picture
Posted by Morgaine Swann on 6 January 2008 - 5:00pm
It's a demanding executive position requiring more than smarts

The president has to be a leader. Inspiring, charismatic, a forceful personality. I'm sorry, but Kucinich strikes me as the nerd in the corner. I cannot for the life of me imagine him facing off with Putin in a summit. Or meeting with the military chiefs. Or using the bully pulpit to bring together the country behind a cause.

As for "corporations," I think we need to be more specific than just ranting about fascism. Most corporations have no part in any of the things you talk about. Most corporations have only a handful of employees and operate month-to-month. Most corporations don't have representatives on K Street. Most corporations don't try to buy legislators or write their own regulations. Most corporations aren't in the business of denying healthcare.

So when you say down with corporations, you're hitting a lot of people who have nothing to do with the things you mention. That's why I ask which corporations, what specific behaviors, and so on.

media girl's picture
Posted by media girl on 6 January 2008 - 7:32pm