Mystery of the day: misogynistic women

Comments

18 comments posted
By stridently saying striden

By stridently saying striden women just need some dick, are they really saying that they themselves could use more servicing? Why does everything come down to insert tab A into slot B?

I believe that the original comment is directed at people that take things too seriously, and applies across both sexes. See, the story goes, that uptight men as well as women might be uptight because they're not "getting any."

Therefore, your choice to interpret it as "strident women just need some dick" assumes a gender-centric focus. They're not women that "hate" women, they don't "hate" themselves, rather they "hate" (and I don't think that that term is quite accurate - more like "snicker at,") people that are so uptight about a lame, racy blogad. (sort of like when Malkin gets ticked at such things on the opposite end of the aisle)

People. That in this case happen to be women. The only comment that elucidates a slap at women is the last one. And as a man, I can verify that I do find men a whole lot more predictable, what with being one and all.

But hey, don't let me get in the way of seeing every slight through a super-focused prism of feminist identity politics. It makes great reading!

Bill from INDC's picture
Posted by Bill from INDC (not verified) on 9 June 2005 - 3:40pm
Okay

You make an interesting point. But I would say that it's a bit different with men. Tell a man he needs to go fuck a woman and relax, and you're endorsing his manhood without attacking his intelligence. Tell a woman she need to get fucked by a man and relax, and you're denigrating her intelligence. That's the cultural frame, the cliche in which we live. As a man, you may not understand, though genitalia haven't prevented other men from grokking that sexual exploitation of women is big business and a popular sport in our society.

You also seem to have missed the heart of the Kos pie conflict -- it wasn't about the ad, but his reaction to objections lodged by a few -- a reaction that managed to insult and dismiss out of hand women's concerns as simply not part of the "important shit."

Of course, you can go ahead and believe what you want. Half the men don't believe this conflict could be about anything that the women say it is. What do we know? We're just a bunch of chicks, right?

Nevertheless, I'm glad you're entertained. Next time you might note the question marks in the posts. I really don't have any answers as to what those women are thinking, and I'm the first to admit I took all of their comments out of the context of their overall blogging. I guess I wasn't curious enough to wade through it all on this beautiful sunny day.

media girl's picture
Posted by media girl on 9 June 2005 - 4:16pm
Strings Attached
Tell a man he needs to go fuck a woman and relax, and you're endorsing his manhood without attacking his intelligence.

I disagree. IMO, telling that to a man implies a couple things:

First, and most important to many, you're implying that he's less than a man. That is, he needs to go get laid because he has been incapable of doing so up to the point of your insult.

Second, to turn your analogy around a bit, you're implying that the man's entire state of mind is tied to his genitalia. That is, you are assuming that the man is incapable of reasonable discussion unless his sexual urges are satisfied.

--|PW|--

pennywit's picture
Posted by pennywit on 9 June 2005 - 5:29pm
No no not at all

I'm not saying it -- our culture says it. Hell, our entire culture seems to revolve around the state of the man's penis. If it's not excited enough, there are billions of dollars of drug sales to help, and then you get happy barefoot couples on television. And if he's stressed out, what he needs (according to our culture) is just some TLC from an accommodating woman who won't make uppity demands like picking up his own socks or not peeing on the toilet seat.

media girl's picture
Posted by media girl on 9 June 2005 - 9:38pm
Humor ...

I did like Bill's bit about "Meet at the Patriarchical Defense Headquarters."

This ought to be interesting if Bill sticks around for a little while ...

--|PW|--

pennywit's picture
Posted by pennywit on 9 June 2005 - 4:18pm
Yes, that made me laugh, too

I'd have mentioned it, but I was hot on the snark. (Sorry, Bill!)

media girl's picture
Posted by media girl on 9 June 2005 - 4:43pm
code of conduct

Well, we have a code of conduct now ...

--|PW|--

pennywit's picture
Posted by pennywit on 9 June 2005 - 7:14pm
Sure, dude

Noticed how you and friends attacked the size of Kos's penis there. Not demonstrating any obsessions there, not at all. Suffice it to say, I love it when people tell me I "need some" since after they find out that I'm a bit over-sexed, the message switches immediately to what a slut I am.

Honestly, the funniest part of the really, really, really tired and cliched sex joke is that she only made it to "prove" that the people who whine about Hollywood liberals are too freak nasty cool. Suuuuuuure. And I make it to church every Sunday.

Amanda's picture
Posted by Amanda (not verified) on 9 June 2005 - 4:54pm
something to remember

I liked your post, and while I agree there are women out there like that I would also suggest that we remember that in the anonymous way the internet is I've discovered that sometimes some of the "women" who post such anti-woman replies turn out to not be women, but men.

Some of the more expert trollers/flamers realize which gender they should claim to be to get the biggest rise. I've experienced this several times in various forums over the years, one time it went on for over a year before we discovered "Susie" was really "Fred"....

Lisa's picture
Posted by Lisa (not verified) on 10 June 2005 - 10:10am
Wingnuts wanted
Matsu's picture
Posted by Matsu on 10 June 2005 - 11:23am
I think that Florida Cracker Just Banned Me

For posting something along these lines:

"I quite agree with you that Amanda's shrill nastiness is unbecoming a woman. Clearly what she needs is a good hard dicking. I sometimes wonder how women even function for 30 minutes without having had a good hard cock-pumping.

So anyway, I agree with you. I'm sick and tired of hearing what women think. And I'm glad to see that all of the dick you are getting is keeping you sane and feminine according to my views of womanhood. I can only pretend to hope that some dashing fellow comes along and fucks that shrill nastiness right out of Amanda. Preferably a Republican, because frankly, a needledicked liberal such as myself just clearly isn't up to the job."

Jedmunds's picture
Posted by Jedmunds (not verified) on 10 June 2005 - 12:20pm
J, you rule

You're my hero. I had to read that one out loud to my boyfriend, who isn't entirely sure what to make of it.

Amanda  Marcotte's picture
Posted by Amanda Marcotte (not verified) on 10 June 2005 - 5:46pm
Internalized sexism is just

Internalized sexism is just as rampant as internalized racism or homophobia. Put another way, until people are free (authentic), they tend to identify with the aggressor, which--in this case--is a male-centric culture.

Women have been told for so long that they would be "okay" if they just had a man, they tend to believe it. Men, as a class, are not told they would be "okay" if they just had a woman. I think that women who say these kinds of things are made so uncomfortable by the comments of an unshackled woman (in this case, Amanda), that they must project their own feelings of inadequacy onto her or risk self-examination.

Diane's picture
Posted by Diane (not verified) on 10 June 2005 - 8:46pm
Thanks for your kind words

. . . about my blog. It would be great if everyone could just relax for a moment.

There was an unfortunate exchange between a few of the Cotillion-ites and the Kos women. It featured some intemperate speech on both sides. As I recall, all of us in the Cotillion were proclaimed "prudes," and we were told that none of us would have been caught in a speakeasy in the 20s because of the suggestive clothing, sexy dancing, and presence of alcohol. When Amanda (IIRC; it was one of us) pointed so a sensual post of her own, it was said that she and her husband were both ugly, and not worth "fucking" unless the would-be seducer were on drugs.

If someone dragged my husband--or a friend's husband--into a stupid blogfight I'd have trouble keeping my mouth shut, too (actually, I did at that point, but didn't want to add fuel to the fire).

Can we all just breathe and tone the rhetoric down a bit? There's plenty we can agree on, and we might actually learn from each other if we can keep from getting too personal.

As to your point, I agree that it's hard to discuss male or female sexuality without the backdrop of the sexual double standard. But we must also be careful not to inject cultural sexism into an offhand remark someone makes that could well be gender-neutral. That is, on occasion sexism is in the eye of the beholder. It's sometimes a subjective call.

All that said, I'm a bitchy person anyway--and when I don't get enough time with my husband in a given week (I believe I'm being clear, here) I'm doubly or triply bitchy.

So maybe conservative women are more given to sexual frustration when they don't get enough "vitamin O," and liberal women are a bit better at zenlike acceptance.

To each her own.

Flame me at will, boys and girls (but do leave my husband out of it, please).

Thanks.

Attila Girl's picture
Posted by Attila Girl (not verified) on 10 June 2005 - 11:20pm
LOL

Thank you, Attila Girl, for making me laugh. I agree.

I can get pretty snarky, too, as I did here even though I was really asking questions -- but when I stop to think, I really do not buy into the partisan nonsense that automatically draws lines based on historical agendas and extremism. The men fight, and we manage as best we can. I think that dynamic crosses party lines and cultural traditions, with some exceptions, I suppose.

Actually, that was why the gasoline finally exploded at DKos. We were expected to toe the line just because.

I've missed the Cotillion/Kos women exchange. To tell the truth, I really don't find much thrill in that. My guess is that if many of these women just happened to meet at a BBQ or spa, the divisions would be lost in the serious or not-so-serious "girl-talk." That's not to say we wouldn't disagree. But how much of the tenor of that conflict was an extension of the loud conservative-progressive/liberal conflict the men engage in? Would we have so many bitch fights if we weren't swimming in a testosterone-driven world?

As for G-spot politics, well, I never considered the political implications of something like vibrator usage. Could that be the secret to feminist empowerment (what you call "zenlike")???

Anyway, I wouldn't dare pick on your husband! That would be un-ladylike.

Drop by and visit again!

media girl's picture
Posted by media girl on 10 June 2005 - 11:53pm
And, speaking of fucking,

I fucked up Darleen's name. She was the one who got into the heated exchange with Amanda (I'm packing for a trip right now, and desperately behind--so my brain's a little fried).

Here's a little context for you:

http://www.pandagon.net/archives/2005/06/we_have_a...

http://www.pandagon.net/archives/2005/06/oh_give_m...

Attila Girl's picture
Posted by Attila Girl (not verified) on 11 June 2005 - 12:09am
Thanks for listening.

That's a very interesting observation. Against the backdrop of women being less well represented in the top-tier blogs, do we have a tendancy sometimes to play down the yin and play up the yang in an unconscious effort to "compete"?

My bias: I still think thoughtful, intelligent women can learn from each other if they try to listen. Not always, but I know that occasionally when I'm talking with my leftist friends and we suspend the playful banter about my being the only Republican in the room, someone (one of them, or me) can say something that really gets the other side to reconsider a facet of its opinion. And I love those moments; I truly do.

As for vibrators: I'll be 43 in a month, and the hormones are calming down a little. But I don't think I would have survived my 30s without my Hitachi Magic Wand. And, BTW--why don't those things last more than a few years . . . ? Aren't they supposed to be well-made? ;)

Attila Girl's picture
Posted by Attila Girl (not verified) on 11 June 2005 - 5:17am
I wonder if

I wonder if this could be adapted.....

media girl's picture
Posted by media girl on 11 June 2005 - 10:04am